# Lounge > Food and Dining >  Wine - expensive vs cheap is there a difference?

## Manhattan

Seems to be quite a bit of snobbery over it and there's plenty of evidence that even sommeliers and "experts" can't distinguish between expensive and cheap stuff in blind taste tests (especially when price is not made available). For the wine drinkers does price make a difference and is there much correlation between price and taste?

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## killramos

This should be a good one

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## ThePenIsMightier

LoL.
Yes, there is - without a doubt.

The thing is, it's not linear and that's the way all luxury items work. A Ferrari might be 20x more money than a Hyundai, but to say "it's 20x better" is kind of dumb.

Tomassi Amarone is maybe 5x more money than Copper Moon, but watch the debate on whether it's 3x better or 30x better.

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## davidI

Part of the problem in Canada is that prices get majorly skewed by tax and duties. Cheap bottles of foreign wine can be very expensive in Canada so two equally priced bottles are not necessarily equally priced in their countries of origin.

Here in Spain, you can get a very enjoyable bottle of wine for 5 Euros. I've bought wines up to 40 Euros here but honestly, even the best rated ones are not that different from our favourite cheapies. 

Perhaps a good bottle can be 25% better in some cases, but pricier bottles can also taste worse than the cheap bottles. A lot depends on your pallete too - people can have very different impressions of the same wine.

There have been studies done that show people statistically are unable to pick the more expensive wine when given a blind tasting (I imagine the same test done with people knowing the price would lead to them preferring the more expensive wines due to our behavioural biases).

Edit: Sumarries of the studies...
https://www.wired.com/2011/04/should...xpensive-wine/
https://www.eurekalert.org/pub_relea...b-we081417.php

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## Manhattan

That's exactly my point. Paying multiples of the price for a decent wine just doesn't seem worth it yet there's a huge industry dedicated to what amounts to be consumer deception yet it continues. I guess that's what marketing is in a nutshell. People pay hundreds of dollars for a pair of Nikes most of which is going to marketing but at least there's no denial that it's all about vanity. With expensive wine the deception seems to go deeper given that there's an illusion of value.

I was watching vids on Architectural Digest (all horribly pretentious) of rich dudes showing off their wine cellar/collections of incredibly expensive wines and the idea behind wine that expensive just seemed ridiculous.

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## ercchry

Would agree it’s hard to put a pure dollar value on this argument as depending on region, taxes, etc the cost can fluctuate.

An apples to apples comparison of same grapes, region/country more expensive tends to yield a better bottle for sure. Always outliers to this and I guess that’s what keeps wines interesting? The ever evolving search for the perfect balance of cost and taste.

The high end french market is a whole other animal though... sell god damn wine futures! First growth costs are exponentially higher than anything else, worth it? Well... they seem to appreciate, so to collect, probably... to drink? Doubt it

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## swak

Why buy a Porsche 911, why not just buy a VW Jetta?

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## killramos

The value of wine has a lot to do with scarcity and yield.

There is definitely a difference between wines, but I don’t pretend to be a sommelier to know how much fruit and sugar they put in an individual bottle.

Just try lots of different stuff and figure out what you like. Honestly unless you drink a fair amount of wine there is far more to try than you could ever want.

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## ExtraSlow

I have a very cheap palate, and I give evidence of that constantly, but yeah, there's a difference in wine that even I can taste. I can do do buy a $10 bottle of wine, and enjoy it, but the $25-45 bottles are noticeably better in most cases. Past that, you'd better be a wine enthusiast to notice the differences, and I admit I cannot.

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## ThePenIsMightier

> ... but I dont pretend to be a sommelier ...



Me neither, although I'll try that for Halloween next year. I dressed up like a Somalian this year and that did not go over well!!

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## killramos

> Me neither, although I'll try that for Halloween next year. I dressed up like a Somalian this year and that did not go over well!!



Pretending to be a sommelier can similarly backfire in spectacular fashion around here

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## ercchry

This is where tastings are fun...

This:



Vs:



Vs:



All very noticeable leaps... events like this make it easier to compare too, this was purely Spain:

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## killramos

I had someone complain that I served them gratis box wine from a novelty pumpkin at a party and that I should open a bottle of better stuff for her. She did not byob.

She didn’t get invited back. Also, wasn’t hot.

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## The_Rural_Juror

There's good wine and there's bad wine of course. Me? I prefer pop.

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## davidI

> Why buy a Porsche 911, why not just buy a VW Jetta?



I wouldn't consider this an appropriate analogy given the specifications are obviously different. If you could drive a Porsche and a Jetta blindfolded you'd notice the difference in handling, response, sound, materials, etc.

If I gave you two glasses of wine that I selected at 2x price points 10x, I'd be surprised if you selected the more expensive one more than 6x.

- - - Updated - - -




> This is where tastings are fun...
> 
> All very noticeable leaps... events like this make it easier to compare too, this was purely Spain:



Which of the 3 did you consider the best?

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## Disoblige

> There's good wine and there's bad wine of course. Me? I prefer pop.



Pop can be expensive too, but you can drink all kinds as long as you disrespect your parents.

Here is a rocket fizz nutmeg Bavarian style root beer.
https://soda-emporium.com/FRESH-16oz...-P5925250.aspx

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## ercchry

> Which of the 3 did you consider the best?



I believe this was a team effort, cause my writing isn’t that legible, especially after drinking  :ROFL!: 



The pingus and Marques de caceres are tough to compare with that age difference though, something that old is so viscous that the mouthfeel is a real standout... well, for me at least, probably borderline over oxidized for some

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## never

> There's good wine and there's bad wine of course. Me? I prefer pop.



Exactly...and to be safe for dinner parties, you're best off to bring some Pepsi and Ringdings.

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## ExtraSlow

If you really want to make enemies go take this discussion to the scotch thread. I don't have the balls for that.

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## Darkane

James Suckling. I let him choose my wines. 

Watched his master class, decent info. Im not a taste describer though. 

What I do I buy any of the wines he scores 90+. Youll find lots in the 92-95 range for mid teens on sale. 

Highlander liquor store in seton is my go to for cheap, high point wines. 

The grape is the most important thing for me. Cab sauv and merlots are my fav. 

I have a 100pt brunello sitting for a special occasion. Ill tell you then if high price is worth it hahaha.

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## davidI

> I believe this was a team effort, cause my writing isn’t that legible, especially after drinking 
> 
> The pingus and Marques de caceres are tough to compare with that age difference though, something that old is so viscous that the mouthfeel is a real standout... well, for me at least, probably borderline over oxidized for some



Sweet. I'm near Ribera del Duero so Rioja wines are a bit sacrilege here but I'll track down that Marques de Caceres - I think it's quite common. Faustina's are also typically very good for the price - my in-laws serve it a lot at their restaurant in Marbella and typically bring 1.5L bottles when they come to visit.




> If you really want to make enemies go take this discussion to the scotch thread. I don't have the balls for that.



Bring it on over. I'm a big fan of a lot of affordable whiskies and will shit all over some of the more recently popular whiskies that are decreasing in quality and increasing in price (Japanese, Laphroaig, Macallen, etc.)

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## Buster

guys, just post your vivino or cellartracker list and get this flex underway properly.

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## Darkane

Mi Terruno 2019
Uvas Malbec
Mendoza, Argentina
91 Points
James Suckling

This is a very serious style of Malbec at a ridiculously low price. Really fresh and delicious. You can't do better than this for under $10.

"A little tight, but very attractive cherry and orange-peel character. Medium body. Fresh finish."
- James Suckling

$9.49
Save Over 50%
(reg $19.99)

Right from my highlander boxing week flyer. That is a great wine for $10. 

Those are the kinds of wines the pros cant tell over a $100 bottle.

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## ercchry

> guys, just post your vivino or cellartracker list and get this flex underway properly.



I’m awful at tracking anything, we use to do an event every other week at willowpark during event season in the before times... and this Spanish thing me is the only thing I seem to have successfully documented  :ROFL!: 

I’m also stuck in an Ilerian peninsula phase... just doesn’t have the same premium as the super Tuscans and Bordeaux tax. Find it harder and harder to justify the French and Italian prices

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## Disoblige

Anything under $18 and rated over 3.7 on vivino and I'm sold.
Never failed me so far  :Big Grin:

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## ercchry

Did a fridge audit:

Drank too much of the good bottles vs replenishing them, whoops
Appear to actually be drinking more Chilean wine currently?
French and Italy game is weak
The Kirkland Rioja wasn’t bad, haven’t tried the other one yet. tasted very familiar. Still trying to pinpoint what it’s a rebottling of, but seems like it should be a grand reserva based on the description? It’s pretty heavily oaked

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## killramos

Is that some Instagram shit?

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## ercchry

> Is that some Instagram shit?



Just for you guys  :Love: 

But yes, I’ve been using layout to reduce amount of individual uploads today

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## Buster

> I’m awful at tracking anything, we use to do an event every other week at willowpark during event season in the before times... and this Spanish thing me is the only thing I seem to have successfully documented 
> 
> I’m also stuck in an Ilerian peninsula phase... just doesn’t have the same premium as the super Tuscans and Bordeaux tax. Find it harder and harder to justify the French and Italian prices



Vivino is easy. Takes two seconds.

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## ercchry

> Vivino is easy. Takes two seconds.



I know... I have it, just awful at keep up with it, I appear to have scanned 5 bottles over a 2 day span in April, and that’s about it haha. Think the GF’s is more complete... still have yet to actually bust it out at an event though

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## The_Rural_Juror

I have a cheapy Margaux next to a James Neal name plate that I am saving for ExtraSlow's birthday.

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## Buster

> I know... I have it, just awful at keep up with it, I appear to have scanned 5 bottles over a 2 day span in April, and that’s about it haha. Think the GF’s is more complete... still have yet to actually bust it out at an event though



I just go full asshole mode nowadays and break it out right in the wine store.

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## ThePenIsMightier

> Pretending to be a sommelier can similarly backfire in spectacular fashion around here

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## max_boost

> Pretending to be a sommelier can similarly backfire in spectacular fashion around here



Oh dang didn’t know you’ve been around that long lol that was a gem of a thread

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## The_Rural_Juror

> Oh dang didn’t know you’ve been around that long lol that was a gem of a thread



Did someone get in trouble for pretending again? I missed out.  :Frown:

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## Mitsu3000gt

This is one of those things like high-end home theater cables and amplifiers - there's a lot of talk until people have to put their money where their mouth is, and that tells you everything you need to know. Some pretty big dollar amounts have been floated around and nobody ever accepts the challenge.

Controlled studies have shown many times that there is no real difference, at least not one that wine snobs and sommeliers are able to tell. There have been lots of blind tests on this - Coles notes is they fail every time to reliably tell a difference, and if asked to put their own money on the line they always decline, which proves they don't even believe it themselves. In some tests, participants were served the exact same glass of wine twice back-to-back and had dramatically different things to say haha.

Something like 90% of wine sold in the USA is in the $10-12 range, probably a bit higher for Canada just because of our insane liquor taxes. If there was an obvious difference in quality or taste for spending more, more people would gladly pay for it, just like any other product.

Expensive wine is usually either rare or old, not necessarily because it's supposed to taste better. Kind of like art in that sense, prices can be incredibly arbitrary.

I love wine and personally I've never had a wine that I really hated, but there are certainly some I like more than others. It is not hard to find 'good' wine between $10-20 in Canada IMO, and it's so subjective anyway that it's difficult to even make recommendations. All you can do is try as many as possible and see what you like yourself. Anyone who tells you they can reliably distinguish between cheap and expensive wine is full of shit, and they would never put their money where their mouth is in a blind test. There's really not a lot to debate on the topic, both blind testing and the wine market itself have given us all the data we need I think.

GM Sommeliers are probably the only ones that have a chance of doing well in a blind test and there are what, a couple hundred of those in the entire world? Everyone else is just like the rest of us haha.

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## max_boost

> Did someone get in trouble for pretending again? I missed out.



Might have been before your time junior but now is your time to shine!!

- - - Updated - - -




> This is one of those things like high-end home theater cables and amplifiers - there's a lot of talk until people have to put their money where their mouth is, and that tells you everything you need to know. Some pretty big dollar amounts have been floated around and nobody ever accepts the challenge.
> 
> Controlled studies have shown many times that there is no real difference, at least not one that wine snobs and sommeliers are able to tell. There have been lots of blind tests on this - Coles notes is they fail every time to reliably tell a difference, and if asked to put their own money on the line they always decline, which proves they don't even believe it themselves. In some tests, participants were served the exact same glass of wine twice back-to-back and had dramatically different things to say haha.
> 
> Something like 90% of wine sold in the USA is in the $10-12 range, probably a bit higher for Canada just because of our insane liquor taxes. If there was an obvious difference in quality or taste for spending more, more people would gladly pay for it, just like any other product.
> 
> Expensive wine is usually either rare or old, not necessarily because it's supposed to taste better. Kind of like art in that sense, prices can be incredibly arbitrary.
> 
> I love wine and personally I've never had a wine that I really hated, but there are certainly some I like more than others. It is not hard to find 'good' wine between $10-20 in Canada IMO, and it's so subjective anyway that it's difficult to even make recommendations. All you can do is try as many as possible and see what you like yourself. Anyone who tells you they can reliably distinguish between cheap and expensive wine is full of shit, and they would never put their money where their mouth is in a blind test. There's really not a lot to debate on the topic, both blind testing and the wine market itself have given us all the data we need I think.



Lol

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## rage2

I buy what tastes good to me. Some are $10 bottles, some are $80. So much personal preference involved with wine, sometimes I feel the experts just suck it up and forcibly pretend to like something haha.

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## max_boost

I only like Riesling and Dom. Do those count lol

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## The_Rural_Juror

> I only like Riesling and Dom. Do those count lol



Snobs prefer reds.

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## Buster

> This is one of those things like high-end home theater cables and amplifiers - there's a lot of talk until people have to put their money where their mouth is, and that tells you everything you need to know. Some pretty big dollar amounts have been floated around and nobody ever accepts the challenge.
> 
> Controlled studies have shown many times that there is no real difference, at least not one that wine snobs and sommeliers are able to tell. There have been lots of blind tests on this - Coles notes is they fail every time to reliably tell a difference, and if asked to put their own money on the line they always decline, which proves they don't even believe it themselves. In some tests, participants were served the exact same glass of wine twice back-to-back and had dramatically different things to say haha.
> 
> Something like 90% of wine sold in the USA is in the $10-12 range, probably a bit higher for Canada just because of our insane liquor taxes. If there was an obvious difference in quality or taste for spending more, more people would gladly pay for it, just like any other product.
> 
> Expensive wine is usually either rare or old, not necessarily because it's supposed to taste better. Kind of like art in that sense, prices can be incredibly arbitrary.
> 
> I love wine and personally I've never had a wine that I really hated, but there are certainly some I like more than others. It is not hard to find 'good' wine between $10-20 in Canada IMO, and it's so subjective anyway that it's difficult to even make recommendations. All you can do is try as many as possible and see what you like yourself. Anyone who tells you they can reliably distinguish between cheap and expensive wine is full of shit, and they would never put their money where their mouth is in a blind test. There's really not a lot to debate on the topic, both blind testing and the wine market itself have given us all the data we need I think.
> ...



I believe this is the single most self-contradicting post I've seen, ever.

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## Neil4Speed

> Anything under $18 and rated over 3.7 on vivino and I'm sold.
> Never failed me so far



I use pretty much exactly the same approach LOL

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## killramos

> I believe this is the single most self-contradicting post I've seen, ever.



He couldn’t decide which expert hat to put in this time

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## Disoblige

> blahblahblah.



Someone needs to take a class on communicating effectively. Fuck me.

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## bulaian

> Anything under $18 and rated over 3.7 on vivino and I'm sold.
> Never failed me so far



Yes, this and the 90+ point wines under $18ish that Co-Op advertises in their flyer.

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## The_Rural_Juror

> Someone needs to take a class on communicating effectively. Fuck me.



I agree. Point form, short sentences, presented in matrices.

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## killramos

> I agree. Point form, short sentences, presented in a matrices.



You betray the loyalty of the ppt!

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## Buster

> I agree. Point form, short sentences, presented in a matrices.



Didn't someone figure out how to do tables around here?

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## Disoblige

> Didn't someone figure out how to do tables around here?



It is the worst experience ever making one on here...

But can't be worse than sitting through a ppt by Mitsu, I guarantee.

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## ercchry

> It is the worst experience ever making one on here...
> 
> But can't be worse than sitting through a ppt by Mitsu, I guarantee.



Is it weird my mind just filled in the gaps in that post? Swear I read or saw something on everything he was trying to say  :ROFL!:

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## Disoblige

> Is it weird my mind just filled in the gaps in that post? Swear I read or saw something on everything he was trying to say



You been on Beyond since '05, should be expert level on filtering through bullshit.

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## Type_S1

I likely have a terrible taste for wine as I mainly drink bourbon/whiskey and beer, however, the 2 buck chuck from Trader Joes ($2/bottle) usually tastes better then most $20-$30 bottles me and the lady try. Ive had expensive wine many times before at functions and I cant say I have ever thought it was good enough for me to buy a bottle myself.

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## Disoblige

> I likely have a terrible taste for wine as I mainly drink bourbon/whiskey and beer, however, the 2 buck chuck from Trader Joe’s ($2/bottle) usually tastes better then most $20-$30 bottles me and the lady try. I’ve had expensive wine many times before at functions and I can’t say I have ever thought it was good enough for me to buy a bottle myself.



I'd probably drink wine every single meal or at least Sangria if we had that here in Canada.

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## The_Rural_Juror

Why don't you make your own Sangria?

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## Disoblige

> Why don't you make your own Sangria?



I do. What I meant was using that $2 wine to make sangria just in case it tasted weird on its own.

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## The_Rural_Juror

> I do. What I meant was using that $2 wine to make sangria just in case it tasted weird on its own.



Step up to a $5 wine, Ribeena, OJ, and fruit of the day. Hypothetically.

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## Disoblige

> Step up to a $5 wine, Ribeena, OJ, and fruit of the day. Hypothetically.



You tried it with Ribena? I don't want it to taste like cough medicine.

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## CompletelyNumb

Points are pretty meaningless these days. 90 points is basically entry level now.

Everyone has a different taste, but there is a definite difference in the quality of the wine making and the quality of the juice that goes into each wine. It's a small window though, I'd say anything between $10 and $80 is more often than not price reflective of quality. Anything over is marketing dollars, anything under is probably bargain bin bulk juice bottled up.

I really can't die on this hill though, since my job is to help wineries around the world sell wine, and plenty of them have expensive bottles. Some just want to be a "luxury" brand. The wine's good, but the bulk of the price is positioning.

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## ExtraSlow

Points:

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## The_Rural_Juror

> You tried it with Ribena? I don't want it to taste like cough medicine.



No. I never waste good grape concentrate. Might as well put Fanta in wine.

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## flipstah

I just go and ask what is good with “insert food here” and it yields great results.

Or I ask 
@ercchry
 cuz he’s the bougiest white guy I know.

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## Disoblige

> No. I never waste good grape concentrate. Might as well put Fanta in wine.



Then why'd you suggest to me! I may have tried it and wasted a perfectly good $10 bottle.

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## Buster

I'm only going to open and consume a finite number of bottles of wine in my life. I don't drink a lot.

So when I open a bottle of wine, I better fucking LOVE it.

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## Darkane

> Points:
> Attachment 96443



I like it. We can be friends.

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## killramos

You guys don’t know that the real secret is the beat wine is the one that comes in the biggest bottle?

It makes sense, they wouldn’t sell that much wine if it wasn’t amazing amirit?

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## ExtraSlow

> You guys don’t know that the real secret is the beat wine is the one that comes in the biggest bottle?
> 
> It makes sense, they wouldn’t sell that much wine if it wasn’t amazing amirit?



Fact. 1L bottles always beat 750ml bottles

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## ercchry

Actually true if you take a spin through the cellar level at willowpark  :ROFL!:

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## ercchry

> Vivino is easy. Takes two seconds.



So Ive been updating it with the little I have saved in photos... and holy shit! You can just buy wine through it now! Game changing...  :ROFL!:

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## colsankey

60 something a bottle(on sale) that might not be 'expensive' wine, but its pretty baller for most people.

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## vengie

Lol, nice flex.

I agree with many here. ~$15-$18/bottle and >3.7 on vivino.

I have my 4-5 go-to wines, then the wife load up every year in Kelowna when we visit our favourite vineyards.

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## ercchry

> 60 something a bottle(on sale) that might not be 'expensive' wine, but its pretty baller for most people.



I usually only shop in that range for gifts, but that’s a damn good deal compared to the last time I bought that bottle! Haha

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## benyl

> He couldnt decide which expert hat to put in this time



 Surprised he didnt mention the berries...

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## SKR

> You guys don’t know that the real secret is the beat wine is the one that comes in the biggest bottle?
> 
> It makes sense, they wouldn’t sell that much wine if it wasn’t amazing amirit?





You used to be able to get this stuff in gallon jugs. It must be the best by a mile. We used to call it Porch Climber. I had a hell of a time trying to remember the real name of it to look it up.

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## Buster

> 60 something a bottle(on sale) that might not be 'expensive' wine, but its pretty baller for most people.

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## The_Rural_Juror

> 60 something a bottle(on sale) that might not be 'expensive' wine, but its pretty baller for most people.



I'm going to channel my inner coupe and say that $250+ a bottle is "expensive".

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## Buster

> I'm going to channel my inner coupe and say that $250+ a bottle is "expensive".



Pleb

#0.72

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## The_Rural_Juror

That is true.

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## ercchry

> Pleb
> 
> #0.72



Can you even play in Bordeaux futures with that??  :ROFL!:

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## killramos

> Can you even play in Bordeaux futures with that??



If you have to ask...

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## kJUMP

Fuck wine, drink champagne. 

(mic drop)

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## Disoblige

> Fuck wine, drink champagne. 
> 
> (mic drop)



No one drinks champagne. It's for jizzing on others.

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## ExtraSlow

This is the way.

- - - Updated - - -

Also reminds me to throw some prosecco into the fridge.

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## ThePenIsMightier

Back when my job was to lift heavy boxes, I was a wino.
Now that I'm all educated & wealthy & shit, I'm a champagno.

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## ercchry

> Also reminds me to throw some prosecco into the fridge.



Cava ftw! ...yup, I think I’m developing a Spanish problem  :ROFL!:

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## max_boost

> I do. What I meant was using that $2 wine to make sangria just in case it tasted weird on its own.



Oh yes. I also love rosé with ice cubes and sangrias lol  :Love:

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## The_Rural_Juror

Transferring some icewine to the fridge too.

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## ExtraSlow

We have ice wine around the house, and nobody drinks it. Does that shit expire?

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## killramos

> This is the way.
> 
> - - - Updated - - -
> 
> Also reminds me to throw some prosecco into the fridge.



Look at this guy, flexing about having a working fridge.

- - - Updated - - -




> Transferring some icewine to the fridge too.



Double flex

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## The_Rural_Juror

Don't you need someone to eat up all your groceries?

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## ExtraSlow

My fridge works, but not all the drawers. So. Only a half flex.

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## rage2

> Fact. 1L bottles always beat 750ml bottles



Nothing beats a magnum.

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## The_Rural_Juror

At Ruth's Chris nonetheless.

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## msommers

A cheapie and a goodie is Halos de Jupiter. ~$17 at Superstore

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## ExtraSlow

I have fond, but fuzzy, memories of drinking directly from a Texas mickey of Canadian Club outside of a Kananaskis Country picnic shelter at 3am. So yeah, larger bottles are better in every case.

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## 89coupe

Grabbed some out of the wine cooler that we enjoy.

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## Buster

> I have fond, but fuzzy, memories of drinking directly from a Texas mickey of Canadian Club outside of a Kananaskis Country picnic shelter at 3am. So yeah, larger bottles are better in every case.



which side of the glory hole were you on?

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## rage2

> At Ruth's Chris nonetheless.



It’s all I have left. Stories of the good old days. Fuck I’m old.

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## roopi

> We have ice wine around the house, and nobody drinks it. Does that shit expire?



I've never seen anyone drink and enjoy this. For some reason people give these as gifts too often.

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## ExtraSlow

Smaller and easier to carry on airplanes.

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## Buster

> It’s all I have left. Stories of the good old days. Fuck I’m old.

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## dirtsniffer

Had a look through a few bottles. 
Amarones and barolos from the early 2010's
California cabs, chianti, austrialian shiraz's from 2015
Riojas, blends, south america, house wines from '17-'18

All at different price point and all are unique. Easy enough to understand why there is different prices. Scarcity, yield, processing, time in cask, stainless vs osk, origin.. 

could I tell the difference between every $20 pinot and a $50 version, probably not. But damn do I love pinots lately. Barely 1 or 2 at home right now.

Interested in seeing some of the ballers collections and storage setups. Probably time for an wine drinkers mega thread.

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## The_Rural_Juror



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## max_boost

> It’s all I have left. Stories of the good old days. Fuck I’m old.



I will pass on your teachings master raj al ghul to the best of my ability  :thumbs up:   :Devil:

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## The_Rural_Juror

> I will pass on your teachings master raj al ghul to the best of my ability



Ice ice baby!

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## suntan

Fun fact: A bottle of wine was considered one serving for one person at each meal.

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## flipstah

> Had a look through a few bottles. 
> Amarones and barolos from the early 2010's
> California cabs, chianti, austrialian shiraz's from 2015
> Riojas, blends, south america, house wines from '17-'18
> 
> All at different price point and all are unique. Easy enough to understand why there is different prices. Scarcity, yield, processing, time in cask, stainless vs osk, origin.. 
> 
> could I tell the difference between every $20 pinot and a $50 version, probably not. But damn do I love pinots lately. Barely 1 or 2 at home right now.
> 
> Interested in seeing some of the ballers collections and storage setups. Probably time for an wine drinkers mega thread.



Isn’t wine supposed to be stored in cellars that are temperature controlled etc? Or is that hocus pocus thing? 

My knowledge of wine is that red goes with meat; white goes with fish and pasta

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## The_Rural_Juror

> Isn’t wine supposed to be stored in cellars that are temperature controlled etc? Or is that hocus pocus thing? 
> 
> My knowledge of wine is that red goes with meat; white goes with fish and pasta



I hear that's what they do in Aspen.

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## Buster

> Isn’t wine supposed to be stored in cellars that are temperature controlled etc? Or is that hocus pocus thing? 
> 
> My knowledge of wine is that red goes with meat; white goes with fish and pasta



This is true, though not as important if you aren't collecting for long periods. But if you have cellared wines that are 20 years old, it's probably a good idea to have them at 15-16C and stable.

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## ExtraSlow

Stable temp more important than cool temp according to my chat with the dude at willow park. But also most wines, particularly inexpensive wines, aren't really meant to be cellared. They won't improve with age. 

I try to have fewer than a dozen bottles hanging around.

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## JustinL

I tried the red one once, it was as bad as expected.

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## killramos

> I tried the red one once, it was as bad as expected.



Well duh. Look how small the bottles are.

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## Buster

> Stable temp more important than cool temp according to my chat with the dude at willow park. But also most wines, particularly inexpensive wines, aren't really meant to be cellared. They won't improve with age. 
> 
> I try to have fewer than a dozen bottles hanging around.



I got it back down under 100...lol.

I don't really plan on collecting/cellaring. My problem is I see/find more interesting wines than I drink. I have to increase my consumption.

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## killramos

> I got it back down under 100...lol.
> 
> I don't really plan on collecting/cellaring. My problem is I see/find more interesting wines than I drink. I have to increase my consumption.



Sounds like a resolution to me

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## dirtsniffer

We have most of our wine in our basement cold room. Stays 10-15c depending on the season. No control as I do not live in Aspen. Maybe 6 bottles would considered worthy of 'cellaring', all big italian reds. Most are just waiting to be drank.

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## Buster

> Sounds like a resolution to me



Cant drink like I used to. Now I want to take a nap and sometimes get a bit of a headache, lol

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## Disoblige

> I tried the red one once, it was as bad as expected.



Haha it is funny. This sells at Costco for $8.99 and it is decent if you like Malbec. Crazy what a buck or two more can do to wine. Can say the same as we head into the teen $ mark too.

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## ercchry

> This is true, though not as important if you aren't collecting for long periods. But if you have cellared wines that are 20 years old, it's probably a good idea to have them at 15-16C and stable.



I would think humidity would play a big factor here too... have had the opportunity to sample some older stuff that’s been kept just in basements on wine racks and those corks were almost completely eroded

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## killramos

So more seriously. This vivino app.

Is that like a collection / cellar management app? A deals app? Review app? Some combo?

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## Disoblige

> So more seriously. This vivino app.
> 
> Is that like a collection / cellar management app? A deals app? Review app? Some combo?



It's great. You take a photo of the bottle through the app at the store or wherever (ex: friend's house if you like the wine) and it pulls it up in the database with a rating, average price for the bottle and a bunch of reviews. It's like yelp for wine but more neat because it recognizes the bottle you take a pic of very well.

I use it every single time I am shopping for wine.

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## Buster

> So more seriously. This vivino app.
> 
> Is that like a collection / cellar management app? A deals app? Review app? Some combo?



It's also social media for wine people. We can also see each other's wines and waht we are drinking and reviewing. 

It also has the ability to track your inventory. The hardest part of that is remembering to click on a bottle when you drink it.

But ya, the algorithm for recognizing the label is really good. You can also take a picture of a wine list at a restaurant and it will pop up ratings reviews and prices for the entire list.

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## killramos

Sounds like a worth install

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## Disoblige

Oh shit I just saw the wine list thing on the app.
That is really cool.

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## ercchry

Wish you could share the cellar though... both the gf and I were updating yesterday and it would be nice to combine some shit

But yeah, drink your wine:

This was very close to turning into garbage

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## Buster

> Wish you could share the cellar though... both the gf and I were updating yesterday and it would be nice to combine some shit
> 
> But yeah, drink your wine:
> 
> This was very close to turning into garbage



Yeah, it's weird that you can't look at other peoples' cellars.

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## Disoblige

Vivino should think about it though.
Would make for some interesting interactive murder mysteries.

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## ercchry

> Yeah, it's weird that you can't look at other peoples' cellars.



To fully become the Strava of alcoholism you need to also be able to tag people with bottles they participated in drinking  :ROFL!: 

But I do enjoy the top ranking reviewers, saw one that had their work email address in their profile; nothing screams “work with me” like crushing 80+ bottles of wine/month  :ROFL!:

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## ThePenIsMightier

I believe I've only had corked wine once.
Two people at the table could tell and two couldn't. It still actually tasted fine, but I guess the two who could tell were quite familiar with that brand. The server agreed and they credited the wine.

Actually, as an aside... The credit turned into a silly debacle. I think the net worth sitting at that table exceeded $100 million and I thought this was funny so I'll share it (with potentially changed names).
Mr. Ford had already generously paid the whole bill. Mr. Chevy and Mr. Dodge were the ones who noticed the foul wine and when the manager returned with a credit for a future visit, they took it without really offering it to Mr. Ford. Granted, Mr. Ford was from California, but it seemed silly to "profit" from a free dinner and not insist that he take it.
I guess they didn't get rich by paying for free wine.

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## Buster

> I believe I've only had corked wine once.
> Two people at the table could tell and two couldn't. It still actually tasted fine, but I guess the two who could tell were quite familiar with that brand. The server agreed and they credited the wine.
> 
> Actually, as an aside... The credit turned into a silly debacle. I think the net worth sitting at that table exceeded $100 million and I thought this was funny so I'll share it (with potentially changed names).
> Mr. Ford had already generously paid the whole bill. Mr. Chevy and Mr. Dodge were the ones who noticed the foul wine and when the manager returned with a credit for a future visit, they took it without really offering it to Mr. Ford. Granted, Mr. Ford was from California, but it seemed silly to "profit" from a free dinner and not insist that he take it.
> I guess they didn't get rich by paying for free wine.



nice flex.

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## killramos

> nice flex.



It’s only a flex if he is porking mr fords daughter

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## ThePenIsMightier

I'm all about dick swinging to close out 2020. 
I know some insane millionaires, and, I couldn't detect corked wine.

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## ExtraSlow

Had the wine waiter once come back to the table to take away a bottle of wine because he said it was corked. The person who tasted it didn't know, and nobody else had been drinking yet. Waiter was very apologetic. Nobody at that table was rich, but I do know rich people, and I've eaten meals with them. Never poked thier daughters but have a buddy who did. /flex

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## ercchry

I once bought a whole case of corked wine, you could see they had an issue with the corker as the corks all had the same damage... it was very noticeable.

The rich guy’s daughter I use to pork didn’t know anything about wine, his ex wife was also THAT person that would order chicken at a steakhouse. Really didn’t need any of that negativity in my life  :ROFL!:

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## Darkane

> Haha it is funny. This sells at Costco for $8.99 and it is decent if you like Malbec. Crazy what a buck or two more can do to wine. Can say the same as we head into the teen $ mark too.
> 
> Attachment 96460



Thats a great cheap wine. 

Its also very good for everyone as a table wine. 

Nobody will hate it.

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## ianmcc

Being the cheap Scot that I am I find myself drinking almost exclusively BIB wine.
Currently working on a box of Bodacious smooth red but really I just pick whatever is on sale. 
Can't have guests over to impress and I am the only one who drinks red anyway.

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## ThePenIsMightier

Plus, the shiny bag makes a great pillow, after!

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## The_Rural_Juror

My new year's resolution is to start hanging out with penismillionaire.

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## Buster

> My new year's resolution is to start hanging out with penismillionaire.



The conversation would be....eclectic.

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## vengie

> I got it back down under 100...lol.
> 
> I don't really plan on collecting/cellaring. My problem is I see/find more interesting wines than I drink. I have to increase my consumption.



I for one would happily volunteer to help you with this monumental feat.

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## ExtraSlow

Beyond meet to get shitty on wine?

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## The_Rural_Juror

I want to increase the table networth by $200.

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## killramos

> I want to increase the table networth by $200.



Might take you AND me to get to $200.

Might be a stretch, apparently I just drank most of my net worth.

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## The_Rural_Juror

Team effort.

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## ExtraSlow

My net worth is gross.

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## dirtsniffer

It's a malbec?

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## ExtraSlow

The wine is great. The wine is not part of my net worth.

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## ercchry

> The wine is great. The wine is not part of my net worth.



Already evacuated it all from your system??

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## vengie

If you’re all looking for a very underrated wine for $17- Rigamarole Red.

It’s a blend, Oliver BC, fantastic for the money.

#notAsommolier

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## bjstare

> I got it back down under 100...lol.
> 
> I don't really plan on collecting/cellaring. My problem is I see/find more interesting wines than I drink. I have to increase my consumption.



Just shoot me a text when you're lonely sometime, I'd be willing to help you thin the herd.

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## Buster

> Just shoot me a text when you're lonely sometime, I'd be willing to help you thin the herd.



We can do a wine night here once this whole covid thing blows over.

I'm seriously contemplating a cigar room in the basement with the renovation, too...something with its own ventilation.

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## killramos

That would be a major flex

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## max_boost

> We can do a wine night here once this whole covid thing blows over.
> 
> I'm seriously contemplating a cigar room in the basement with the renovation, too...something with its own ventilation.



Oh man that would be seriously boss. Fkn love it.  :Pimpin':   :Pimpin':

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## Buster

> Wish you could share the cellar though... both the gf and I were updating yesterday and it would be nice to combine some shit



Just discovered you can export your cellar to excel. Not the best, but workable. Doesn't seem to export quantities, though.

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## The_Rural_Juror

I don't drink much but I will reserve the Orin Swifts, Giscours, Duckhorns, Caymus, Giscours, Masi, Stags' Leaps if you are ever having a party.

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## Buster

> I don't drink much but I will reserve the Orin Swifts, Giscours, Duckhorns, Caymus, Giscours, Masi, Stags' Leaps if you are ever having a party.



I love anything that comes out of Orin Swift.

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## SkiBum5.0

> I love anything that comes out of Orin Swift.



Agree. Haven’t tried the Machete, but I bought a case of Prisoner when Willow Springs had it on for $49. Ditto for the Stags Cab Sauv 2016. I miss America for wine. My all timer is Oakville Estates Cab Sav, but it is overpriced up here.

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## Buster

> Agree. Haven’t tried the Machete, but I bought a case of Prisoner when Willow Springs had it on for $49. Ditto for the Stags Cab Sauv 2016. I miss America for wine. My all timer is Oakville Estates Cab Sav, but it is overpriced up here.



Machete is awesome, especially for the price.

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## ercchry

Vaguely remember trying this one at a tasting a while back... have had the “red” Lan a million times, this bottle is basically a value buy, well worth the difference; well perhaps, have to grab a bottle of the reserva for a final decision. Don’t remember that one either

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## 89coupe

Hope my client likes this bottle.

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## ThePenIsMightier

*corked vinegar

----------


## 89coupe

> *corked vinegar



I sure hope not

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## you&me

> Hope my client likes this bottle.
> 
> Attachment 106845



I have a client that's a wine distributor and when we close a deal, he usually gifts me several bottles of wine. As we got to know each other better, I made a joke when we were in his cellar (amazeballs, by the way) about holding out on me with the good stuff. 

He responded by telling me that he knew I'd appreciate a crazy bottle, but instead he wanted to share his more accessible favourites, knowing I'd be able to buy them myself on a more regular basis... I still continue to purchase bottles he's given me frequently and always remember who introduced me to that particular wine... 

There's a time and a place for an $800 bottle - and the purchase of a home is certainly an occasion worth celebrating - but there might be an opportunity for you if you gift your clients something they're more likely to drink again and again and build that mental association... Just my 2c.

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## msommers

Thanks for the recommendations for Orin Swift, every bottle has be great.

----------


## 89coupe

> I have a client that's a wine distributor and when we close a deal, he usually gifts me several bottles of wine. As we got to know each other better, I made a joke when we were in his cellar (amazeballs, by the way) about holding out on me with the good stuff. 
> 
> He responded by telling me that he knew I'd appreciate a crazy bottle, but instead he wanted to share his more accessible favourites, knowing I'd be able to buy them myself on a more regular basis... I still continue to purchase bottles he's given me frequently and always remember who introduced me to that particular wine... 
> 
> There's a time and a place for an $800 bottle - and the purchase of a home is certainly an occasion worth celebrating - but there might be an opportunity for you if you gift your clients something they're more likely to drink again and again and build that mental association... Just my 2c.



Well said.

This particular client has an extensive wine collection as well, so I was hoping to get her something with a little wow factor. When she invites us over for dinners or they come to our place she always brings 5 or 6 bottles with her. So I feel this is appropriate in this case.

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## Buster

> Thanks for the recommendations for Orin Swift, every bottle has be great.



I love verything Orin Swift.

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## SKR

> amazeballs



why

----------

