# Car Forums > Automotive News >  finally some good news on Aston Martin

## Buster

https://jalopnik.com/f1-billionaire-...-on-1841380731

This is pretty great overall. Aston was basically heading towards insolvency/bankruptcy.

I don't love the idea of a hybrid V6, but it's better than nothing I guess?

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## rage2

> https://jalopnik.com/f1-billionaire-...-on-1841380731
> 
> This is pretty great overall. Aston was basically heading towards insolvency/bankruptcy.
> 
> I don't love the idea of a hybrid V6, but it's better than nothing I guess?



I'll just crosspost from the F1 thread.




> So Aston Martin needed to do big advertising because their DB11 isn't selling?
> 
> Racing Point is now AM Racing






> Not exactly.
> 
> AM is on its way of going bust. Lawrence Stroll bought in to save the company on the cheap, and raising additional cash through his investment firm with his backing.
> 
> Racing Point is a money pit for Lawrence Stroll to bankroll his son Lance's career. Prior to racing point, he was dumping a boat load of money into Williams so Lance could have a drive. Might as well dump that money into his own team. It's still a losing proposition for him, but with AM ownership, he can funnel some AM money into it to lessen how much he has to invest there.
> 
> Essentially, Lawrence Stroll and his parters are paying 180m GBP into AM, so that AM can partially fund Racing Point (presumably much more than 180m over long term), with the team being called AM for marketing purposes. It's a no loss situation for Stroll, if the marketing value increases AM brand awareness, he wins. If AM burns through money and goes under, he will have bled more of AM to offset what he would've continued to pay into Racing Point, and probably still end up with a Valkyrie as a bonus lol.
> 
> Rich people get richer.



Don't think for 1 second this is to save AM. This could be a Sears in the making for all we know.

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## Xtrema

> I'll just crosspost from the F1 thread.
> Don't think for 1 second this is to save AM. This could be a Sears in the making for all we know.



Daimler still own 5% of AM? In exchange of infotainment system and engine? Wonder now Geely lost out, and AM stock is in the gutter, Daimler will sell those can cut the losses.

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## SSO

> Don't think for 1 second this is to save AM. This could be a Sears in the making for all we know.



Its looking more and more that you might be right. Just did a more in-depth article on what is going on at Aston Martin and its not particularly pretty. They have major issues still with the Valkyrie, Valhalla is still a dream, and DBX not really looking like it will be the savior.

https://karenable.com/catching-up-wi...rrari-mclaren/

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## rage2

> Its looking more and more that you might be right. Just did a more in-depth article on what is going on at Aston Martin and its not particularly pretty. They have major issues still with the Valkyrie, Valhalla is still a dream, and DBX not really looking like it will be the savior.
> 
> https://karenable.com/catching-up-wi...rrari-mclaren/



The saddest part about all this is that they pulled in Tobias Moers. He single handedly transformed AMG cars from straight line luxury barges to serious sports cars. I know he was upset at Mercedes for downsizing engines, going hybrid, and EV, but I don't see any automaker having a choice. Really wish he stayed and adapted.

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## Buster

> The saddest part about all this is that they pulled in Tobias Moers. He single handedly transformed AMG cars from straight line luxury barges to serious sports cars. I know he was upset at Mercedes for downsizing engines, going hybrid, and EV, but I don't see any automaker having a choice. Really wish he stayed and adapted.



He also made AMG a simple "brand" over a label with substance. (I don't care or mind that, but it is what it is.)

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## SSO

Reality is AMG / Mercedes doesn't have a choice on the engine downsizing. The irony is he will still have to use the downsize engines he was upset about at Aston (if he stays).

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## rage2

> Reality is AMG / Mercedes doesn't have a choice on the engine downsizing. The irony is he will still have to use the downsize engines he was upset about at Aston (if he stays).



Yup. He was just delaying the inevitable.

I would've loved to see what he could've done in the AMG EV space.

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## benyl

> He also made AMG a simple "brand" over a label with substance. (I don't care or mind that, but it is what it is.)



I don't think that was Tobias. C450 AMG Sport came out in 2015 shortly after Ola Källenius gave up the reigns to Tobias. And the whole Mercedes-Benz, Mercedes-AMG, Mercedes-Maybach rebranding was under Ola as CEO of MB.

Looked up Ola on wiki and found this gem:




> His wife is a green influencer (part of the Green Globe Organisation) and is pushing the plug-in hybrid and wants him to make the entire Mercedes-Benz range, including the flagship G-Wagon, fully electric.

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## SSO

> Yup. He was just delaying the inevitable.
> 
> I would've loved to see what he could've done in the AMG EV space.



We may get a chance to see it. I am sure he will end up back at Mercedes in the not t0o distant future.

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## rage2

No Valkyrie thread so I’ll post this here. Track only version sounds awesome.

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## BavarianBeast

Sounds incredible, engine must not be built by amg

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## rage2

> Sounds incredible, engine must not be built by amg



No turbos to silence it. That and this is the track only unrestricted Valkyrie Pro. The street version with the silly EU regulations sound tiny in comparison but still better than AMG one.

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## vengie

Holy Hannah that sounds incredible.

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## SSO

> Sounds incredible, engine must not be built by amg



Its a Cosworth engine

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## SSO

It is not looking good for Aston Martin:

https://karenable.com/turtle-soup-as...-2022-results/

even with the latest cash raise, they will likely run out of money again in 12-18 months.

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## killramos

Shame.

But they deserve it for thinking the DBX was a good idea.

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## you&me

> Shame.
> 
> But they deserve it for thinking the DBX was a good idea.



Sure. I mean, SUVs have been a fountain of sales and revenue for literally every other luxury manufacturer, but the DBX was a bad idea.  :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic): 

Questionable execution, maybe (though it's actually supposed to be a great truck), but not a bad idea.

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## Buster

> It is not looking good for Aston Martin:
> 
> https://karenable.com/turtle-soup-as...-2022-results/
> 
> even with the latest cash raise, they will likely run out of money again in 12-18 months.



thanks for popping in, we were just chatting about you the other day.

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## killramos

> Sure. I mean, SUVs have been a fountain of sales and revenue for literally every other luxury manufacturer, but the DBX was a bad idea. 
> 
> Questionable execution, maybe (though it's actually supposed to be a great truck), but not a bad idea.



Truck? Oh boy

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## bjstare

So Lambo, Ferrari, Porsche can all make an SUV (Porsche being the most pertinent case example, where it was the cash cow they needed)… but it’s a bad idea for AM to try the same thing? Not only was it a good idea, it was one of the few options they had  :dunno:

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## Buster

The VAG ones needed barely any additional r+d. And we haven't seen the purosangue yet.

- - - Updated - - -

Lambo must be ridiculously profitable for vag. They charge a massive premium over the Audi versions and they haven't needed to do any r+d in about 15 years

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## killramos

> So Lambo, Ferrari, Porsche can all make an SUV (Porsche being the most pertinent case example, where it was the cash cow they needed)… but it’s a bad idea for AM to try the same thing? Not only was it a good idea, it was one of the few options they had



As Buster said. AM didn’t get to just put a new badge on a Touareg.

They are also 20 years too late to the game. Big shocker it didn’t work.

Fast forward to today. It’s a mediocre looking SUV ( seriously, it looks like a Nissan or something) barely recognizable as an Aston Martin. And dealer lots are full of them.

I’ve seen maybe one on the streets? Very meh.

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## bjstare

Yes, all that is valid… the success of the idea isn’t the point of contention. I agree with you both there. 

I’ll ask again: what other remotely feasible options did they have?

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## SSO

> thanks for popping in, we were just chatting about you the other day.



Hopefully on the positive side..... :Angel: 

Its been a really busy summer.

- - - Updated - - -




> Shame.
> 
> But they deserve it for thinking the DBX was a good idea.



It was a good idea...........if they had launched it in 2002.

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## killramos

> They are also 20 years too late to the game. Big shocker it didn’t work.






> Hopefully on the positive side.....
> 
> Its been a really busy summer.
> 
> - - - Updated - - -
> 
> 
> 
> It was a good idea...........if they had launched it in 2002.



Yes see my expansion above. I still would have rather they didn’t do it, Tata should really just own AM and let RR be their SUV cash cow.

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## Buster

> Hopefully on the positive side.....
> 
> Its been a really busy summer.
> 
> - - - Updated - - -
> 
> 
> .



Oh for sure... We were discussing how your content was interesting.

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## SSO

> Yes see my expansion above. I still would have rather they didnt do it, Tata should really just own AM and let RR be their SUV cash cow.



Overall I would agree, AML should stick to making front engine GTs.

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## Buster

I think AM is done in it's current form, isn't it?

They really ought to be the exotic brand for a bigger OEM.

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## killramos

> I think AM is done in it's current form, isn't it?
> 
> They really ought to be the exotic brand for a bigger OEM.



I had always assumed that was the soft plan with Moers…

Let AM make the cars AMG couldn’t because ESG

I wouldn’t have hated that plan

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## SSO

> I had always assumed that was the soft plan with Moers
> 
> Let AM make the cars AMG couldnt because ESG
> 
> I wouldnt have hated that plan



It actually wasn't. Mercedes was happy to see the back of Moers head when he left. If they did want to buy the business, Mercedes has had several opportunities and they have passed each time.

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## rage2

@SSO
 do you have any info on how much money Aston Martin is funneling into the f1 team?

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## SSO

> @SSO
>  do you have any info on how much money Aston Martin is funneling into the f1 team?



AML is paying AMR GP GBP 21 mil. per year as a sponsorship fee. Stroll is also using AMR GP techs to work on the Valkyries and then billing AML for the time, work, etc.

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## rage2

> AML is paying AMR GP GBP 21 mil. per year as a sponsorship fee. Stroll is also using AMR GP techs to work on the Valkyries and then billing AML for the time, work, etc.



Thanks. Surprised it’s that low as title sponsorship. Maybe my theory in post 2 is wrong haha.

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## SSO

> Thanks. Surprised its that low as title sponsorship. Maybe my theory in post 2 is wrong haha.



Its the going rate.

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## vengie

@SSO

What is said content you put out that 
@Buster
 mentioned?
Sounds interesting

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## killramos

> @SSO
> 
> What is said content you put out that 
> @Buster
>  mentioned?
> Sounds interesting



https://karenable.com/about/

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## SSO

> @SSO
> 
> What is said content you put out that 
> @Buster
>  mentioned?
> Sounds interesting



My guess is this: https://karenable.com/turtle-soup-as...-2022-results/

or 

https://karenable.com/supercar-marke...sis-july-2022/

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## Buster

> @SSO
> 
> What is said content you put out that 
> @Buster
>  mentioned?
> Sounds interesting



 
@SSO
 is a good writer with good analytical abilities (and I presume experience) and is also an owner willing to actually wrote about this stuff. It's a rare combination and I'm as interested in the topics as much as the cars nowadays.

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## SSO

> @SSO
>  is a good writer with good analytical abilities (and I presume experience) and is also an owner willing to actually wrote about this stuff. It's a rare combination and I'm as interested in the topics as much as the cars nowadays.



Much appreciated.

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